Guest: Robbin Zeff, author of The Nonprofit Guide to the Internet and Advertising on the Internet.
Co-hosts: Sean Bailey, Philanthropy-Journal, and Peter Tavernise, Duke University

Sean Bailey: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 2:04PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Welcome to Nonprofit Web Talk. Today our guest is Robbin Zeff, author the Nonprofit Guide to the Internet. Robbin, why don't you tell us a little about yourself and why you wrote this book?

Robbin Zeff: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 2:09PM EST (-0500 GMT)

I wrote this book because it enabled me to combine two interests--nonprofit organizations and the Internet. And it was the right time to write the book. First of all, the Internet is poised to be the premiere communication vehicle in the next millennium. And secondly, nonprofits are online and active like never before.

Robbin : . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 2:10PM EST (-0500 GMT)

I have a long history with the nonprofit community. My parents instilled in us a strong sense of civic duty. We were always a volunteering family. I started my professional nonprofit career, working for a public radio station in Colorado. Then, while in graduate school at Indiana University in Bloomington, Indiana, I worked with many environmental organizations and wrote my dissertation on the rise of grassroots environmentalism in the 1980s. In 1989 I moved to Washington, D.C. to work for a national environmental organization. And since opening my own consulting business in 1994, I have consulted and conducted training seminars for the nonprofit community world-wide.

Sean Bailey: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 2:17PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Okay. So why this book?

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 2:19PM EST (-0500 GMT)

I wrote this book because I believe in that the Internet is a vital community vehicle for nonprofits. And I wrote this book for anyone involved in an organization that has or wants an Internet presence. And since just about everyone is involved in some organization or affiliation somewhere, I guess you could say that just about everyone can benefit from this book.

Specifically, this book is for those who work for a nonprofit organization in a senior management -- executive director, fundraiser, communications, press -- or are just a summer intern. This book is for those who are volunteer for an organization part time or serve as a member of the Board of Directors. This book is also for the person who is thinking about starting an association or for the person who is a long time member of an association. Whatever your role, you and your organization can benefit from the material in this book.

Sean: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 2:30PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Here's an earlier question from anonymous: I direct both a public and private foundation. I have been told by Web Pagecreators that it's a must for me to have a page, at least for the public foundation because it will result in donations. Any fact to this? What is your experience withfoundations and Web pages? Remember, this is a grant making foundation, but as a public foundation, it welcomes gifts.

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 2:33PM EST (-0500 GMT)

I think in this day and age, itıs important for a public and private foundation to have a presence on the Internet because itıs another way to reach your community. As a grant making institution, you can use your web site to service those you fund as well as informing the public of your programs. In terms of donations, your site can help you reach people who may not otherwise know of your good work.

Will you receive unsolicited donations online? Itıs possible. The web is a high income zip code, so to speak. The profile of the average web user is a well educated man or woman (65% male) with a plus $50,000 income. These are the kinds of people with money to donate. The question remains will you reach a person on the Net that is interested in the specific work of your foundation and will then be inspired to give? This is happening all the time.

Sean: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 2:35PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Here's a question from Martin in Holland: Hello. I'm a student trying to find out whether the Internet can help Dutch fundraisers to make money or achieve their goals via better communication. Problem is that our country only has 15 million inhabitants. So, can you give some clear examples of organizations that have been able raise funds on the Internet. How did they do that? I would like to find out their approach would be able to succeed in my country, small as it is, with up till now, still relatively few Internet users. Thanks a lot.

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:56PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Here's an answer to Martin from Holland's question: People are raising money on the Internet. They are doing this by asking for direct donations like the American Red Cross (www.redcross.org), by selling merchandise such as the Jimmy V Foundation (www.jimmyv.org) selling t-shirts or the Human Rights Campaign with its catalogue of merchandise (ww.hrc.org). They do it by asking people to join specific campaigns like Impact Onlineıs "Cookin on the Net" (www.impactonline.org) and Ethiopian Jewryıs Hanukah campaign (www.cais.com/nacoej/index.html).

In fact, everyone of these sites uses a variety of approaches, all ask for donations as well as their other programs. Like any good fundraising campaign, itıs important to have a diversified approach. The Net is no different. Why are they successful? Because theyıve identified their community and are servicing that community.

In response they are receiving contributions from those they help and need their services the most. And, of course, the occasional "angel" that gives because they care. And finally, the Net excels at target marketing. Asking a million people to donate is like a shot in the dark. Asking people who know something about your issue is increasing the odds. But asking people who come to your web site, you are already "qualified" leads, is giving even better odds for success.

Sean ...Now question from Graham Carter of New Zealand:

I run a Christian-based nonprofit for the benefit of the Polynesian people of the South Pacific Islands. We are based in New Zealand and are needing seed money and capital to launch it. Would an Internet search of US foundations be exhaustive (ie: are they all present on the Net yet? With all the information we would need to approach them? Because of time zones and distances, telephoning from NZ to US is a problem, so can we use the Net to make our initial approach to foundations? Or is direct personal contact with an officer of the foundation required before mailing our proposal? Robbin, I haven't seen your book in New Zealand. Can I order it direct (for shipping to NZ) and pay by MasterCard? Thanks for your help.

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:11PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Great to be back up and running. OK let me start answering some questions. I'll begin with Graham Carter from New Zealand The Internet is a great place to do foundation fundraising research. I suggest starting your search on the Foundation Centerıs site (www.fdncenter.org). They hand links to all foundations (both public and private) that are on the Net. However, it is important to note that not all foundations are online, but the oneıs that are give a wealth of information on their sites. You asked if you can use the Net to make your initital approach to the foundation?

Many foundations provide the email addresses for their program officers or the email address for the foundation in general. It is perfectly acceptable to contact the foundation via email. In fact, some will even let you submit your application electronically. You can order my book from Wiley by calling 1800-753-0655 ext 4457 or you can order it online from amazon books (www.amazon.com).

Bruce Rosenthal, National Foundation for Women Business Owners: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 1:41PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Robbin, two questions: First, how are nonprofit organizations using the Internet effectively for their public relations efforts. Second, is there a "killer application" of the Internet for nonprofits? Thanks.

Robbin Zeff: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 2:05PM EST (-0500 GMT)

I want to welcome everyone here today. Bruce, You asked two very good questions. First, I think there are three "killer apps" for nonprofits. The first is email. This is the number one most popular application on the net. The second is chat and the third is discussion software. These are killer apps for nonprofits because they facilitate the exchange of information.

Pam Harrison, Animal Refuge Center: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 2:31PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Is it your suggestion for non-profits to get chat and discussion program software for their site in order to establish community or supporter forums, with instant exchange of ideas? How affordable is that for smaller nonprofits?

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:14PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Pam, If you can't afford to put this software on your site, and there are many freeware and shareware versions, then I suggest you participate in the many chats and discussions that exit online. Use the Internet to get the word out about your organization. There is a direct correlation between good public relations and outreach and successful fundraising.

Sean:...Pam, I'll add that Robbin is correct about freeware and shareware software. If you do a search for "Matt's CGI Archive" you'll find many useful "scripts" that can be used on your Web pages to to facilitate forums and the exchange of ideas.

Peter Tavernise:

Hi Robin. I'm co-hosting the web chat today from Durham, NC and have a few questions to get us started. First, in her foreword to your book Patricia Pasqual, Director of the Foundation Center, concludes that after reading your book, "nonprofit managers will realize that, in order to preserve and build the communities needed to help society into the next millenium, they must lead their organizations onto the information superhighway sooner rather than later." That's pretty strong language. Could you talk a little bit about how it might be not just desirable, but necessary for nonprofits to get online in order to best accomplish their missions?

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:18PM EST (-0500 GMT)

To answer Peter's first question. Iıd like to use the example of email. Email is the most popular application on the Internet. In fact, the first thing people do when they go online is check their mail. Email addresses are quickly becoming as pervasive as fax numbers. Sending email is quick, and inexpensive. With all the letters and newsletters that organizations produce, using email efficiently is a cost saving mechanism. In fact, the Internet can help an organization save money in many ways. From reducing postage costs, conference call fees, and printing costs. Also, the Internet allows you to reach your base through a personalized and one-to-one experience. It will truly be the next best thing to being there.

Robbin : . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:20PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Peter asked how a nonprofit can reduce costs for building a web site? There are several options. First you can always reduce their costs by doing some of the work in-house. Also, finding a web design firm that might offer reduced fees or do your site pro bono. And lastly, you might want to contact the local high school or college and have your site be a student assignment. Some of the best work being done on the Net comes from college students.

Michael Sullivan: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:23PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Our organization does research, policy analysis, advocacy, organizing and education on health and human service issues. We are setting up a Web site and I'm wondering: 1) What are the pros and cons of putting information online that we'd normally sell through membership or publications sales - do we encourage or discourage membership and sales?; 2) Is there any solid data on who uses nonprofit sites as opposed to other sites? Who is the audience and how are they reached? How do we do effective publicity?

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:27PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Michael just asked what are the pros and cons of putting info online tha you'd normally sell. People on the net are use to getting information for free. And that is the million dollar question on the web right now, how to make information self supporting when people don't want to pay for it. I recommend giving away some information for free, and then charging for the full version. This is the established pattern on the web. Thus far, subscription models haven't worked well. But people do buy reports and books on the web. One need look no future than Amazon books to see how well one can do selling books online.

Sue Bell: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 2:16PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Robbin--what Websites have you found that are the most interesting and exciting models for those of us in the process of creating/updating ours?

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:23PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Sue asked what are some good examples of nonprofit sites. OK here's my list of favorites. First, the American Red Cross (www.redcross.org) is extremely strong in fundraising because they ask early and often on their site. I also like The Nature Conservacy site for its formulaic nature (www.tnc.org). If you want to see some shockwave added to fundraising check out the Rainforest Action Network (www.ran.org)

Robbin:. . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:29PM EST (-0500 GMT)

I want to continue answering Sue's question about "good example" sites. In terms of advocacy, I think the Feminist Majority Site (www.feminist.org) and NARAL (www.naral.org) are excellent examples. The Children's Defense Fund has done some interesting actions with kids. And the Human Rights Campaign has an outstanding site for contacting Congress.

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:33PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Sue Bell also asked what is an efficient method of disseminating information about product donations online. First, you can contact sites directly. The Contact Center (www.contact.org) has a very thorough list of nonprofit organizations. Second you can post of newsgroups such as soc.org.nonprofit. Probably the most effective would be to post this to mailing lists such as Prospct L and the others where nonprofits participate.

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:36PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Peter asked if anyone is actually raising money on the Net. Definitely. Nonprofits are seeing an increase in small dollar donations from their Web presence. For example, in September of 1995, more than 30% of the American Red Cross' donations given via their 800 number were generated by their Internet site. That number is rising dramatically, now that they accept online donations. Small organizations are equally seeing success. Circus Ethiopia, a circus comprised of children from refugee camps in Ethiopia, is receiving regular contributions from its site both in small amounts as well as the occasional large contribution.

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:52PM EST (-0500 GMT)

I think there is great potential for corporation and nonprofits to work together. First, every nonprofit services a known community. The beauty of the web is that one can reach such niche markets on a one-to-one basis. I think if a nonprofit can team up with a company that is trying to reach the same audience the nonprofit services, the two can help each other. The nonprofit helps by delivering an audience and the corporation helps by financially supporting the nonprofit sites. Now, some might worry that this will compromise the integrity of the information on the nonprofit web site. If the corporation's goal is to gain increased traffic to their site, they will probably not want editorial say. But that is certainly a concern an organization needs to address.

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:54PM EST (-0500 GMT)

In terms of public service announcements, I know that the Internet advertising community is very interested in promoting web public service announcements. Also, some of the ad networks like DoubleClick do include nonprofits in their network.

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:38PM EST (-0500 GMT)

I think we're just about caught up. Does anyone have any new questions or comments?

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:40PM EST (-0500 GMT)

I want to introduce a new thread of discussion. Advertising is taking the Internet by storm. Are any of you trying to find corporate sponsors for your site? Corporations are looking for ways to drive traffic to their site and your page might draw just the audience the corporate is looking for.

Sean: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:44PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Robbin, I think that's a good question. What should a nonprofit's pitch be when looking for a corporate sponsor? What are the selling points?

Peter Tavernise: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:44PM EST (-0500 GMT) Yes, Robbin, one more question: I understand that your current work involves advertsising on the web. Do you see any possible or potential intersections between for-profit web efforts and non-profit sites? I'm thinking of your Rhino Beer example. Tangentially, are there any web strategies that for-profit ventures use successfully that could be adopted by nonprofits?

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:52PM EST (-0500 GMT)

I think there is great potential for corporation and nonprofits to work together. First, every nonprofit services a known community. The beauty of the web is that one can reach such niche markets on a one-to-one basis. I think if a nonprofit can team up with a company that is trying to reach the same audience the nonprofit services, the two can help each other. The nonprofit helps by delivering an audiene and the corporation helps by financially supporting the nonprofit sites. Now, some might worry that this will compromise the integrity of the information on the nonprofit web site. If the corporation's goal is to gain increased traffic to their site, they will probably not want editorial say. But that is certainly a concern an organization needs to address.

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:54PM EST (-0500 GMT)

In terms of public service announcements, I know that the Internet advertising community is very interested in promoting web public service announcements. Also, some of the ad networks like DoubleClick do include nonprofits in their network.

Peter Tavernise: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 3:58PM EST (-0500 GMT)

Thanks, Robbin and Sean! It's about four o'clock and I have to sign off. Take care.

Robbin: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 4:07PM EST (-0500 GMT)

I want to thank everyone who participated, especially Sean Bailey for inviting me to participate today.. If you have any follow up questions, I can be contacted at robbin@zeff.com. Take care.

Sean: . . . . Wed, Dec 18, 4:07PM EST (-0500 GMT)